From: snow <snow@smoke.suba.com>
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 21:04:11 -0800 (PST)
To: jbugden@smtplink.alis.ca
Subject: Re: Counterproductive Dorothy Denning Flames
In-Reply-To: <9610278491.AA849142344@smtplink.alis.ca>
Message-ID: <199611280521.XAA01849@smoke.suba.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


> mpd@netcom.com (Mike Duvos) wrote:
>>It is perhaps a point in Dr. Denning's favor that her most
>>vitriolic detractors can spell neither "Dorothy" nor "fascist".
>>I must admit that I am at a loss to understand the heat which
>>Dorothy Denning generates on the Cypherpunks list
>It should not surprise you too much, as people have often vilified those th=
> ey
> disagree with.=20
> The more you accept the other person as a human being, the more difficult it
> becomes to dismiss their view without first confronting the issues. It's ea=
> sier
> to treat them as an idiot, and then their views becomes idiotic by associat=
> ion.

     I don't think anyone believes Denning is an Idiot. Maybe that her
position is Idiotic, that she give the wrong weight to certain ideas and
beliefs when taking a position, but not an idiot.

     I also don't think that you _have_ to vilify your opponent when engaging
in political conflict. I have had many many arguments in my life over 
issues such as Socialism, Government (lack of) Rights, Peoples Rights etc. In
some cases I called my opponents idiots and worse. Usually because they were.
In other cases I was clearly dealing with an intelligent individual who either
was getting the wrong information, or started with different premises(sp?) 
than me. 

     Denning clearly believes that the government is a better judge of me and
my fellow man than I am. She is wrong, and history proves that. Does that
make her an idiot? No. Foolish? Perhaps. 

     As to facist, I don't really know her well enough to tell, but anytime 
someone believes that the government has the right to tell private enterprise
what they can and can't produce, that person is getting very very near to 
being facist. If the foo shits... 


Petro, Christopher C.
petro@suba.com <prefered for any non-list stuff>
snow@smoke.suba.com