1997-06-05 - Re: McVeigh

Header Data

From: Paul Bradley <paul@fatmans.demon.co.uk>
To: Hallam-Baker <hallam@ai.mit.edu>
Message Hash: a4ca120664939790509d5d05f7dd988f718e47489bc95de880c6609da0f4b0c6
Message ID: <Pine.LNX.3.91.970604231629.624D-100000@fatmans.demon.co.uk>
Reply To: <199706042113.RAA15819@muesli.ai.mit.edu>
UTC Datetime: 1997-06-05 08:14:22 UTC
Raw Date: Thu, 5 Jun 1997 16:14:22 +0800

Raw message

From: Paul Bradley <paul@fatmans.demon.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 5 Jun 1997 16:14:22 +0800
To: Hallam-Baker <hallam@ai.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: McVeigh
In-Reply-To: <199706042113.RAA15819@muesli.ai.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.91.970604231629.624D-100000@fatmans.demon.co.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

> Give it a rest. The people inside had already murdered several BATF
> agents. They had every opportunity to release the children and allow
> them to get to safety. They had every opportunity to surrender.

The acts were not of murder, the compound inhabitants were simply acting 
in response to the BATF agents actions of trespass, of course they had 
opportunity to surrender, so did the jews in nazi Germany.

> The US police may be incompetent and corrupt but that does not excuse
> the Oaklahoma bombing nor does it in any way lessen the responsibility of
> McVeigh and those who encouraged him.

For once I agree, but on a trivial and unimportant point.

Further those who encouraged him may be responsible, but are not guilty 
of any crime.

> If you have a duly authorised warrant from a court, the inhabitants have
> shot at people from inside the building and you give them two months to
> surrender, sure go for it.

If the people they shot at were trespassing on their land they have done 
nothing wrong. If I come to your front door and give you 2 months to 
surrender your house to me, I think I can predict your reaction.

> yeah peacefull types whose response to a visit from the police was to
> lie in ambush and shoot at them with automatic weapons.

Quite so, the police are agressors by trespassing on their land they 
commited an initiation of agression. Don`t give me this "reasonable 
force" bullshit either.

> So are you suggesting that the police ignore the complaints of illegal
> ownership of firearms and child abuse?

Yes, illegal ownership of firearms is an oxymoron, no weapons should be 
illegal. As for the child abuse, that is a thornier subject, but the 
police had no right to be there.

> And in any case the point is that Waco does not absolve McVeigh and
> the militias for the blame for Oaklahoma.

No, but it doesn`t change the fact that no-one is supporting McVeighs 
agressive act against the children in that building. There are many sides 
to this case, it is not just a black and white case, there are a lot of 
angles one can analyse and judge it from.

        Datacomms Technologies data security
       Paul Bradley, Paul@fatmans.demon.co.uk
  Paul@crypto.uk.eu.org, Paul@cryptography.uk.eu.org    
      Email for PGP public key, ID: FC76DA85
     "Don`t forget to mount a scratch monkey"