From: jsantala@walli.uwasa.fi (Jukka Santala)
Date: Sun, 27 Aug 95 04:44:33 PDT
Subject: Re: C2.ORG REMAILER
In-Reply-To: <41gsan$elo@utopia.hacktic.nl>
Message-ID: <vxFQws0p3fRe084yn@walli.uwasa.fi>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


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In scroll <41jnqn$qgm@nntp.crl.com>, Nobody wrote:
> sameer@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (Sameer Parekh) wrote:
>> Community COnneXion will not reveal the identity of non-anonymous
>> account holders without a court order or explicit permission from
>> the account holder.
> Sameer - You caved WAAAY too easily - I will suggest that we ban ALL
> inclusion of your reamiler in any chain, due to the fact tha your
> c2.org CAN NOT be trusted to resist pressure.  See ya on the c-punks
> area.

Now, Nobody, that is chickenshit if anything, and I "suggest" you
know it.  The actions taken by Community ConneXion in no way prove
that it would be any less trustable in this matter than any other
remailer in the world.  In fact, certain coolheadedness to all
parties present is, in my opinion, one of the main requirements of
respectable remailer.  In fact, had c2.org been pinned down for the
copyright infrigment with no ability to point the real infriger, CoS
could well have stood a change to get hold of any possible remailer
logs.

Just like in the anon.penet.fi case, where Helsingius gave out the
entries identifying the account in question instead of holding them
back at the risk of getting all the entries confiscated.  It's
called picking the lesser evil.  In fact, the only effect you stand
to gain from accusing people of such acts is perhaps making them
that much more inclined to really co-operate with your enemy next
time they ask for it.

Furthermore, altough Sameer could've been pretty sure of even
monetary support from the 'net community in his battles against CoS,
I personally think such would only be waste of resources.  The
copyrights of OT materials will be found out in Erlich's case,
posting them publicly in Lerma's case and the common provider status
of ISP's will be tested in Netcom's case.  In my opinion, we stand
nothing to gain, only lose, from increasing the number of cases
further.  Not to even mention that the Fishman documents have now
been temporarily sealed, which further clouds the issue.

Finally, I hope you do know that the reason of actually using
remailer-chains is the admittance that some of them might be
compromised.  The idea behind remailer chains is that each and every
one of the mailers in the chain needs first to be identified and
then compromised to successfully find out the real poster.
"Banning" it out of the remailer chains, even if possible, would
serve no purpose.  Posting the facts and letting people make their
own decisions based on those could, perhaps, be warranted.

  Regards,
    Donwulff

Intergalactic terrorist and arms dealer, squire for Knights of Xenu.
Operation Entheta National Command, captain Donwulff of Discordia.
Tell your people.  alt.religion.scientology   Let The World Know!
           -><- Hail Eris! All hail Discordia! -><-

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