From: Matt Blaze <mab@crypto.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 95 16:03:46 PST
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Subject: Re: revised time quantization package (Unix & WIN32) available
In-Reply-To: <199512192232.WAA18554@pangaea.ang.ecafe.org>
Message-ID: <199512200009.TAA17192@crypto.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


I don't normally like to respond to anonymous kooks, but...

cpunk@remail.ecafe.org (ECafe Anonymous Remailer) writes:
> AT&T Spokesman Matt Blaze writes:
> blah blah
> >There are (basically) no restrictions on the use or distribution
> >of the (very simple) code.
> 
> This is simply untrue. Read the fine print in the file. Use this code
> and you owe them big. They'll "reach out and touch" you big time.
> If they were serious, they'd gpl it.
> 

Since I don't understand what you're talking about, I can't really
respond to it.  The only restrictions on the use of this code are that
you have to acknowledge where it came from and that it comes with no
waranty.  You also have to keep the notice in place on any copies you give
to anyone else.  Just like the GPL, only without the nutty requirement
that you also give away your own source code.

> >Get it from:
> >	ftp://research.att.com/dist/mab/quantize.shar
> >
> >The quantize package is also part of Jack Lacy's cryptolib package
> >(watch this space for details).
> 
> I don't understand why this group continues to tolerate these blatently
> commercial messages from att (and netscape.) (The message is
> really just an ad for the cryptolib product, as it says). I've also said
> this b4 but I'll say it again: why would anyone in their right mind trust
> binary code from att after the clipper fiasco.

I think you're confused.  AT&T Bell Labs Research (which is soon to be
split into two parts, Bell Labs and AT&T Labs, owned by two different
companies starting next year) is a research laboratory.  A lot of very
good cryptology and security people work here.  While AT&T (the
parent company) is in the products and services business, AT&T Bell Labs
doesn't sell any products or services itself.  Like most of the
computer science researchers in Bell labs (and like those in universities
and elsewhere), I publish the results of most the work that I do (modulo
some consulting I do for the moneymaking part of the company in order
to "pay the rent").  I (like many other researchers) also sometimes create
software in the course of my work.  When this might be of use to others,
I prefer to give it away rather than let it sit idle on my disk.  The
quantization code (like CFS, swIPe and others) is an example.  CryptoLib
is another example; it was created by my colleague Jack Lacy.  We give that
away, too.  Bell Labs doesn't advertise anything.  We don't have retail 
customers.  Our research software is unconnected with AT&T's commercial
activities.  We make it available because that's what members of the research 
community do.  Its distribution is neither purely altruistic nor especially
mercenary.  If you really like our research software, I guess you can switch
your long distance service to AT&T or buy an AT&T answering machine or
something.  But that part of the company is very remote from my food chain.
I'm from the part of the company that _spends_ money.  Other parts _make_
the money.

> And why do we tolerate Jeff Weinstein and Mat Blaze calling themselves
> cypherpunks, when they are so clearly just working us for their
> corporate interests?

Again, I think you're confused.  Jeff Weinstein works for Netscape, not
AT&T.  I think there's a connection between AT&T and Netscape somewhere
(like we bundle netscape with worldnet service), but I don't really
know the details.

> I wonder how much they get paid to monitor this list?

I can't speak for Jeff Weinstein, but in my case, not nearly enough.

-matt
"I'm from The Phone Company and I'm here to help you."