From: snow <snow@smoke.suba.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 13:34:45 -0700 (PDT)
To: attila@primenet.com
Subject: Re: "Right to Privacy" and Crypto
In-Reply-To: <199610152205.QAA03946@infowest.com>
Message-ID: <199610161948.OAA10231@smoke.suba.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text


Mr. Hun said:
> In <3.0b19.32.19961015115525.0067560c@panix.com>, on 10/15/96 
>    at 11:57 AM, Duncan Frissell <frissell@panix.com> said:
>         no they cannot physically torture, but they can put your 
>     intelligent, educated, civilized little white ass in with some some
>     real sweet boyfriends, or sadists, or racists who are just waiting
>     for revenge, or just plain killers "--oops, made a classification
>     error;" and the tag on your toe says: "john doe #1276549860"
> 
>         and nothing prevents them from talking about poor Harry who did 
>     not cooperate...

     And you still claim that AP has _no_ moral basis? 

     Is there more than one person using your account? 

     This may get me in a lot of shit, but if anyone _anyone_ treats a member
of _my_ family that way, Ohhhh shit, I'd _never_ get out of jail, assuming that
I make it that far. 

     I am not old enough to have served in Vietnam, but I did serve in the 
military, and I didn't do it to protect scumsucking politicians and shithead
sadist facist police. I did it for the college money, and because at one
point in my mis-guided youth I beleived in the constitution.

     I still think it's a good idea, and I realize that the great one-horned one
is probably right about the courts interpretation of the constitution. I also
realize that they have a certain vested interest in the status quo, and that
they had to _start_ with a certain mindset/attitude to get where their 
interpretations carry the weight that they do.  

> -."Note that many governments have officially given up rape and torture as
> -.sanctions.  (These were once universal.)  All we have to do is get them
> -.to give up murder, imprisonment, and robbery as sanctions and we'll have
> -.civilized them completely."
> -.
>         although I will certainly agree with your tongue-in-cheek 
>     comment...
> 
>         wish to check the cases of rape while in custody? --don't forget 
>     to include sodomy by bubba, foreign objects for women, etc.  did 
>     law enforcement do this?  indirectly, yes, by failing to protect the
>     accused.

     I think he was refering to geovernments in general, rather than _just
the US government (although I won't deny that it has happened here) the 
SS in germany certainly used rape and torture, and I'd bet it still goes 
on in certain countries. 

>         reinstate physical torture by the state --at least you'll live
>     through it!  they need you in court to parade as an example before
>     they hustle you off for reeducation.

     1) You might not live thru it, and if it was legal, then they _might_
be tempted to go just a little too far.

     2) I am really hoping that the above was sarcasm. 

Petro, Christopher C.
petro@suba.com <prefered for any non-list stuff>
snow@smoke.suba.com