From: roy@sendai.scytale.com (Roy M. Silvernail)
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 18:02:14 -0700 (PDT)
To: tcmay@got.net (Timothy C. May)
Subject: Re: Fuck Cyberpromo
In-Reply-To: <v03007800ae88444f9194@[207.167.93.63]>
Message-ID: <961014.190846.2c3.rnr.w165w@sendai.scytale.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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In list.cypherpunks, tcmay@got.net writes:

>>Anyone on the list know of a good, heavy-handed collection agency that
>>would like to take this when it tops, say, $500?
>
> What contract do you have with savetrees.com that allows you to invoice
> them? Do you have a Purchase Order number?

I have records of three warnings to discontinue sending robotic email
harrassments.  I think that 3 instances of "send no mail whatsoever to
the domains of scytale.com and cybrspc.mn.org" carries some weight.

> While I certainly am equally annoyed with their crap, I am also annoyed by
> all sorts of "unwanted mail" I receive. Including unwanted _physical_ mail.

Unwanted physical mail doesn't cost me money to receive.  Unwanted
email, on the other hand, carries a real and calculable cost.  I don't
have flat rate access to a POP mailbox.  I have UUCP mail forwarding for
my 2 domains, carrying hourly connect fees.  How does this differ from
the cost of consumable fax machine supplies?

> The "junk fax" law was carefully crafted to cover only continuing,
> persistent, and extensive abuse of fax machines....and I'm not even sure it
> would stand up in court (lawyers may have a clearer idea).

[...]

> And it is not written to cover e-mail, of course.

IANAL, but at least one interpretation I've read finds a computer, modem and
printer equivalent to a fax machine.  And CyberPromo's mail campaign is
"continuing, persistent, and extensive", given that the messages persist
in the face of no less than 8 demands that they cease.

> Also, there's the risk of a _countersuit_ if an "official-looking" invoice
> is sent to a company. Why? Turns out that a scam that is spreading is the
> invoicing of companies for supplies and services never actually
> provided....

The invoices I send clearly state that the charges are handling fees for
harrassing email, and include dates and message id's.  I'm not invoicing
for copier toner or light bulbs.  I'm keeping copies of the
harrassments, as well.  Therefore, I'm charging for a service actually
provided: that of handling the harrassment.  Let him sue.

> Until "junk e-mail" laws are passed (not that I support them, by the way),
> not much can be done.
>
> A precedent-setting case would of course cost a lot of money to follow
> through on.

True enough, but I'm going to do what I can.
- -- 
           Roy M. Silvernail     [ ]      roy@scytale.com
DNRC Minister Plenipotentiary of All Things Confusing, Software Division
PGP Public Key fingerprint =  31 86 EC B9 DB 76 A7 54  13 0B 6A 6B CC 09 18 B6
                Key available from pubkey@scytale.com

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