From: Tim May <tcmay@got.net>
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 1997 12:01:22 +0800
To: cypherpunks@cyberpass.net
Subject: Re: Hettinga's e$yllogism
In-Reply-To: <199706222220.AAA26096@basement.replay.com>
Message-ID: <v03102801afd3a3255d09@[207.167.93.63]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain



At 3:53 PM -0700 6/22/97, William H. Geiger III wrote:
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
>In <199706222220.AAA26096@basement.replay.com>, on 06/23/97
>   at 12:20 AM, nobody@REPLAY.COM (Anonymous) said:
>
>>>  Digital Commerce *is* Financial Cryptography,
>>>  Financial Cryptography *is* Strong Cryptography,
>>>  therefore,
>>>  Digital Commerce *is* Strong Cryptography.
>>>  and, therefore,
>>>  No Strong Cryptography, no Digital Commerce.
>
>>Why can't escrowed ecash support digital commerce?  Strong crypto with a
>>government backdoor.  That's what you're offered.  Prove it can't work.
>
>Because no one with any sence is going to trust their finacial
>transactions to third party access and minipulation.

People do it all the time. The "third parties" are called "bankers." (And
escrow agents, and loan officers, and bank guards, and so on.)

I agree with "anonymous" that Bob Hettinga's syllogism is unconvincing.

Now, I happen to believe that untraceable, strong communications and
monetary instruments allow for amazing things.

But claiming that digital commerce is impossible with an escrowed key
system is not a very persuasive argument. (It is true that some major hacks
of the escrowed system would undermine confidence in e-commerce, but so
would major hacks of today's SWIFT or similar systems. So?)

Bob's syllogism is just too simplistic, and it won't be convicing to people
who have to deal with human weak links in existing systems, and even with
government interference and government ability to intervene (FinCEN,
freezing of assets, regulation, etc.).

Beware too much simplification. It may make for nice t-shirts, but....

--Tim May



There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."