From: Toto <toto@sk.sympatico.ca>
Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 05:59:14 +0800
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Subject: The _Really_ Big Lie!
Message-ID: <33EB8A5E.7661@sk.sympatico.ca>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain



::
Anon-To: too_drunk_to_use_a_remailer@shit!.exposed!

[From the "I Have Too Much 'Time, Inc.' On My Hands, So This Must Be 
 _Official_ News" Web site.]
 
  I couldn't help but notice that the supposed pillars of the religious
community, as well as their oh-so-decent-and-righteous followers, tell
such widespread, whoppingly big lies about the motivations behind their
public actions, as well as about their future intentions, that the true
source of corruption in the religious community must undoubtedly come
from "higher up" in the chain of commandments.

  For example, those who are concerned about their children accessing
obscene and satanic material on the InterNet might be expected to
supervise their children, as well as acquiring the InterNet tools that
are available for limiting their children's access to things which the
parents find objectionable. You would also expect them to seek out
information on sites that met standards that they found acceptable for
their children to access.
  In short, if their interests truly lay in censoring the information
their children access, you think they would do exactly that--control
and censor their children's activities on, and access to, the InterNet.

  I couldn't help but notice that, instead, they want to control the
activities and access of everyone who uses the InterNet. I find it hard
to believe that these people can claim to have the intellect to form
valid beliefs about religious and moral issues, yet not be intelligent
enough to understand the options available to them.
  This leads me to suspect that they are, in reality, two-faced liars,
particularly since impartial observers can predict the oppressive and
censorous results which are usually the exact opposite of what they
claim to be their intentions.

Patient: "Doctor, it hurts when I do _this_."
Doctor: "Then don't _do_ that."

   If those calling for control and censorship are truly worried about
their children, you would expect then to teach their children not to
"do that," and to not make available to them things which will allow 
them to "do that" if they have raised their children to be disobedient
and/or irresponsible.
  Instead, they seem to be taking the moral "high ground," as if under
the impression that they are moral "doctors" charged with diagnosing
others as having diseased morals, even if the others don't hurt when
they "do that."

Problem: Little Johnny wants to visit Paul Bradley's "Jesus Loves the
  Little Children From Behind" web site.
Solution: Don't let him do that.

Problem: Little Johnny might visit the Duncan Frissel "Pictures of 
  Jesus" site and find pictures of Jesus buggering the little children.
Solution: Don't let Little Johnny access sites that you don't know to
  be acceptable according to your standards.

  Now, was the foregoing too hard for those reading this to understand?
  If not, then what could be the reason for those promoting contol and
censoring of other people for suggesting the following option...
Problem: Little Johnny might access something on the InterNet which does
  not meet standards that his parent's find acceptable.
Solution: Require everyone on the InterNet to only engage in activities
  which meet the standards of Little Johnny's parents, starting by 
  putting the onus on everyone on the InterNet to "voluntarily" rate
  their website according to the standards of Little Johnny's parents.

Question:"When was the last time a doctor you didn't know made a 'house
  call' to check on your health, forced his way in when you objected,
  and gave you a prostrate exam against your wishes?"
Answer:"When the government declared that prostrate cancer was a threat
  to 'national security' and that early detection would 'protect the
  children' from child molesters and drug dealers."

  Since spirituality is not inherently related to fascism, it seemed to
me that the moral fascism being promoted by members of the Christian
community must be the result, not of spiritual values, but rather,
the result of the leader of the Christian religion being a moral
fascist.
  It was also obvious that, given the vast amount of lies being told
by Christians about their beliefs, motivations, and intentions, that
Christianity must be founded on lies and disinformation.
  Since I do not like to speak ill of someone without taking pains to
understand them from the standpoint of their own knowledge and beliefs,
I decided that I should have a talk with Jesus Christ, the founder and
espoused leader of the Christian religion, and give him a chance to 
respond to my view of himself and those who follow his example.

  Mr. Christ was kind enough to let me take notes during our long
conversation, so I am providing a transcript of the highlites of
the issues we discussed:
-----------------------
TruthMonger: "Mr. Christ..."
Jesus Christ: "Please, call me Jesus."

TruthMonger: "OK. Jesus, what the fuck is going on with all these people
  claiming that they have the right to force everyone on the face of the
  earth to live only within the boundaries of moral judgements approved 
  of by you?"
Jesus Christ: "Well, TruthMonger, you have to understand that I am the
  _only_ Way, the _only_ Truth, and the _only_ Light.  Accordingly, it
  is reasonable for my followers come to the conclusion that whatever
  I approve of is good and that everything else is bad."

TruthMonger: "As in, 'Everything Not Permitted, Is Forbidden!'?"
Jesus Christ: "Exactly. By the way, is that from '1984' or from 'Animal
  Farm'?"

TruthMonger: "Don't try to change the subject. Jesus! Oh, I mean that
  as a swear word, by the way...but this is exactly what I object to
  in your followers--the fuckers never give a straight, truthful 
  answer to the 'hard' questions. They always fall back on some inane
  quote of yours that has little to do with the issue being discussed."
Jesus Christ: "Well, you can't hold me accountable for their actions..."

TruthMonger: "Like _fuck_ I _can't_, shit for brains. You're in America,
  buddy, and we have conspiracy laws here. If the members of your cult
  go down, then you go down with them, and vice-versa.
  "You ever hear of Waco? David Koresh? Maharishi? John F. Kennedy?"
Jesus Christ: "You're trying to twist things around here, by comparing
  me and my followers to small cults and Democrats. After all, America
  is largely a Christian nation with Republican family values."

TruthMonger: "Bullshit! It's a democracy, with a legal seperation of
  Church and State. "America is a Christian nation" is just one more
  example of the lies your followers try to propogate every chance
  they get. It's clearly not true, but they refuse to face reality."
Jesus Christ: "I said, 'largely'."

TruthMonger: "Exactly. You use a word that infers that a 'majority'
  of Americans are Christian, in order to suggest that Christianity
  and Democracy are kissing cousins. This is the same goddamn thing
  that your followers do by constantly taking a smug, self-righteous
  stance that concepts like freedom, democracy, right and wrong, are
  all dependent on or connected to the Christian 'majority's' beliefs
  and morals.
  "You could just as well say, 'America is largely a "white" nation'
  but that pig doesn't fly anymore."
Jesus Christ: "Now _you're_ trying to twist _my_ words."

TruthMonger: "Christ! Oh, that's meant to be a swear word, too...BTW.
  "What I mean is that your words are being twisted a lot more by
  your Christian bum-buddies than I could ever hope to manage.
  "Which wouldn't concern me in the least if they weren't trying to
  force a potpourri of alleged 'superior' moral beliefs on the rest
  of us. This is the crux of the matter. As far as I am concerned.
  Christian fascism is the enemy of democracy and freedom."
Jesus Christ: "Well, that's one way of looking at it. However, you
  might also say, 'It's not perfect, but it's the best system we've
  got.'"

TruthMonger: "Please don't insult my intelligence. You could say the
  same thing about a bowl of 'shit' soup, if that's all that you put
  on the dinner menu. Christians and politicians have always tried
  to claim that their failure to permit true freedom should be seen
  as a sign that it cannot be achieved by others, either.
  "The logic is based on the assumption that politicians and Christians
  are superior to everyone else, and that they know and do what is
  'right'. Then they turn around and claim that, since they are doing
  what is 'right', that their judgements are superior to everyone 
  else's.
  "That's called Circular Logic, and that dog's getting old, too."
Jesus Christ: "When the Dogs of Holy War get old, they get craftier,
  as well."
  "In case you haven't noticed, the censoring of non-Christian beliefs
  is proceeding pretty much as it always has. When was the last time
  you heard of someone getting imprisoned for exposing children to
  Biblical tales of violence and sex, on or off of the InterNet?"

TruthMonger: "You've certainly got a point there. Tim May's vernacular
  translation of the Bible describes Lot fucking his daughters and the
  guy who pulls out and jerks off on the ground, or whatever, in great
  detail."
  "This serves to illustrate the hypocritical lies and bullshit that
  Christians promote. If Tim wrote a similar story about himself just
  screwing the living shit out of his children, then the fascist
  Christians would call for his imprisonment as a child molester,
  even if Tim announced it was fiction. But a Christian who puts the
  a story about Lot doing the same thing, only claiming that it is
  true, won't go to jail even if I stand up in court and testify
  that, after I read it, I went out and fucked my daughters."
Jesus Christ: "And your point is...?"

TruthMonger: "My point is that fucking is fucking, butt-fucking is
  butt-fucking, and there are enough people capable of free thought
  left in society, and who are wise to your Christian bullshit, that,
  if I were you, I wouldn't hurry back to take over until you're
  sure that your fascist lackeys have all the freedom lovers in
  chains."
Jesus Christ: "Is that supposed to be some kind of threat?"

TruthMonger: "Hey, pal. All I'm saying is that what is good for the
  gander is good for the goose.
  "As long as this country remains a democracy, then you'd better
  think twice about claiming to 'love all the little children' and
  you'd damn sure better make certain you have all the right permits
  before you go around turning water into wine."
Jesus Christ: "I resent the implication that I love the children 
  in anything but a purely 'spiritual' way."

TruthMonger: "Well, pal, the circumstantial evidence is against you
  on this one. Wasn't your father involved in some kind of scandal
  where he made a man and woman naked and then told them to fuck
  and party down?"
  "If I remember right, he had some kind of fetish about telling the
  Jews to fuck a lot and was always talking about their 'cum'."
Jesus Christ: "He used _decent_ words, like 'be fruitful and 
  multiply', and 'seed', not 'cum'."
  "And you should have capitalized the word 'Father' when you made
  mention of him, BTW"

TruthMonger: "Fuck you pal, I'm sending this to the CypherPunks
  mailing list. Are you the new list moderator? 
  "Good fucking luck..."
Jesus Christ: "I don't have to take this kind of abuse. I'm putting
  you on the 'flames' list."

TruthMonger: "Big deal. I'm already in Tim C. May's 'killfile'."
Jesus Christ: "If intolerance is such a Christian trait as you claim,
  then why is my 'flames' list smaller than Tim May's 'killfile'?"

TruthMonger: "Now you're twisting _my_ words. Are you related to
  Kent Crispin? Say... Come to think of it, why has no one ever seen
  the two of you together?"
Jesus Christ: "Let's just say that Kent and I agree on many issues
  that have to do with the sanctity of a higher authority.
  "No one has ever seen the evil Dr. Vulis and Satan together, either,
  but that's no proof of anything."

TruthMonger: "Bad example, dude. Bad example. You're practically 
  proving my point for me."
  "But now that you've brought it up, I would like to point out that
  both you and Satan are free to post anything you want on the 
  CypherPunks list, but if Tim May posted his vernacular translation
  of the Bible on Christian mailing lists, he would be hung by his
  hairy balls from the nearest church tower."
Jesus Christ: "How do you know Tim May has hairy balls?"

TruthMonger: "You've never been to a CypherPunks physical meeting,
  have you? Trust me, when the CypherPunks focus their energy on
  turning wine into water, _nobody's_ math skills are good enough
  to calculate what might take place."
Jesus Christ: "And your point is...?"

TruthMonger: "My point is that I'm drunk, it's late, and we both
  have a lot of work to do before the year 2000.
  "If you're planning to censor non-Christian values on the InterNet
  for 'all of eternity', then you'd better get to work on a way to
  stop the CypherPunks 'Eternity Server' from routing around fascist
  Christian moralism."
Jesus Christ: "Adam Back... Isn't he a member of that weirdo "Circle
  of Eunuchs" cult?"

TruthMonger: "That's for me to know, and for you to find out, pal.
  "Unless you can break PGP, of course."
Jesus Christ: "Hey, I'm just Jesus. I'm not Phil Zimmerman, for 
  _My_ sake."

TruthMonger: "Hey, watch your language."
Jesus Christ: "Sorry, I meant to say 'for _Dimitri's_ sake'."

TruthMonger: "I'll tell him you capitalized his name. He'll get a
  kick out of that.
  "Any last words before I turn in for the night?"
Jesus Christ: "Christianity recognizes privacy and freedom as damage,
  and steamrollers over them."

TruthMonger: "No shit!"
-----------------------

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
All references to Tim C. May's Vernacular Translation of the Bible
are used without permission.
What's he going to do, sue me? Then he'd have to admits he gets
vicarious pleasure out of reading the posts in his killfile.
{There's more than _one_ way to push a <Delete> key.}
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~