From: "William H. Geiger III" <whgiii@amaranth.com>
Date: Sun, 24 Aug 1997 10:43:57 +0800
To: Jim Choate <ravage@ssz.com>
Subject: Re: Reproductive Rights and State Benefits (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <199708240135.UAA27615@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: <199708240241.VAA09743@mailhub.amaranth.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain



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In <199708240135.UAA27615@einstein.ssz.com>, on 08/23/97 
   at 08:35 PM, Jim Choate <ravage@ssz.com> said:

>Forwarded message:

>> From: "William H. Geiger III" <whgiii@amaranth.com>
>> Date: Sat, 23 Aug 97 20:10:12 -0400
>> Subject: Re: Reproductive Rights and State Benefits (fwd)

>> Well yes and no. Just because you are willing to give you liberty away
>> does not mean that you have the right to give my liberty away.

>Which is why we implimented a representative democracy in the first
>place.

>> That's why
>> the Bill of Rights pre-empts any legislation done by Congress or the
>> States.

>It does? You are without a doubt reading a different Constitution and
>Bill of Rights than the one that I have. If you are making allusion to
>the 14th, it only extends to privileges and immunities.

> 
>			       ARTICLE XIV. 
> 
>Section 1.  All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and 
>subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States 
>and of the State wherein they reside.  No State shall make or enforce 
>any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens  of
>the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, 
>liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person 
>within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. 
> 
>Section 2 to Section 5 deleted


>So you equate your right to religion as a immunity or a privilige? Me I
>take it as a right, something outside the legal purvue of the federal
>government. An immunity or privilige is something that can be taken away
>by the body granting it. Since the Constitution is a mandate from the
>people it follows clearly that the only body that can change that mandate
>is the people. If the state I live in has a constitution that allows it
>that is between me and my state and none of you or your states or the
>federal governments business.


Well you are complicating the issue by assuming that we are in two
different states. If you and I are citizens of the same State you do not
have the right to deny me my rights protected under the Constitution of
the United States of America regardless wether you are in the majority
view or not. Of cource the laws of one State do not have power over
another State.

I do not consider the Bill of Rights as giving me "privileges" but giving
me immunity from any government restricting those rights.


Article. IV.

Section. 2.

Clause 1:  The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to
all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States. 


Section. 4. The United States shall guarantee to every
State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect
each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the
Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened)
against domestic Violence. 


Article. VI.


Clause 2:  This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which
shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall
be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme
Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any
Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary
notwithstanding. 


I think that this clause more than any other shows exactly where the
States stand. So long as a law passed by Congress is in accordance with
the Constitution the States are obligated to obey such laws regardless of
the Laws & Constitutions of the States.




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William H. Geiger III  http://www.amaranth.com/~whgiii
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