From: Anonymous <nobody@replay.com>
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 21:35:53 +0800
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Subject: Re: Larry Gilbert, AOLers, and the Hyper-real flamer
Message-ID: <199809150228.EAA19097@replay.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain



On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, Paul H. Merrill wrote:

> 
> I love this to death.  Some asshole sends crap data to sixdegrees
> including dredged up real email addresses, then when sixdegrees and the
> contacts given react in a totally appropriate manner other (?) assholes
> berate them for living.  And this one even manages to toss in an
> anti-AOL rant where AOL plays no part.
> 
> Such witticisms I haven't seen since my kids turned 7.
> 
> PHM

I know of several people in addition to myself who have complained to
Sixdegrees about this. I've personally given up sending complaints back to
them, and I lost count at 5. Sixdegrees simply ignores them. I've sent
them to their upstream sites, and they either ignore them or tell me that
they've forwarded them to Sixdegrees. My complaints, at least, were very
civil. One explained exactly what a mailing list was, for crying out loud. 
I can't speak for Hyper-real's (if he sent any) and the others. You may be
able to use that defense if Sixdegrees didn't know, but they do. 

Sixdegrees could avoid these problems very easily by adding a domain
verification so that somebody from Netcom can't specify some address at
toad.com and have it work. They haven't. They haven't because they don't
care. Saying that some sites have screwed up rDNS and mail domains isn't a
valid excuse. They can insert exemptions for Hotmail, MSN, Juno, and other
sites like that if they want. Oh, maybe they have a "phobia" of this, just
like AOLers apparently have a "phobia" of even making an attempt to use
English properly, so it's okay. 

I don't think the parallel between the AOL users spamming the list and
organizations like Sixdegrees spamming the list is that uncalled for
either. Maybe you find any drawing of parallels offensive, Paul, and maybe
you'll denounce it as "propoganda" because I might use an example in this
message, and maybe you just really like AOL and think its cluelessness and
broken software is the best thing since sliced bread, but that doesn't
change the fact that Sixdegrees and friends are doing the same thing AOL
is and that it's abuse of the network. They fire a salvo, and somebody
else fires one back at their expense.

By this logic, I'd next expect to read a claim that since the AOLers are
getting the Cypherpunks address from somewhere, we should welcome their
requests for band stickers and things like "how u do that." After all,
they're the victims, and are probably the kind of people who go to look up
the word "gullible" when somebody tells them it isn't in the dictionary.

It's a long-established tradition to flame people like this. Some flames
are better than others. Maybe if the Hyper-real user insults them enough
they'll finally add Cypherpunks to their block list. 

I've personally grown real sick of seeing bullshit passwords, welcome
messages, new password messages, updates, and other junk on this list from
sites which don't bother to verify domain names. I can give them that, but
I start to get pissed when they refuse to block the address. For that
reason I don't mind the person or persons who are flaming these idiots and
in fact, like Mr. May, I cheer them on. Personally, I *WANT* them to pour
nitric acid into their computers to destroy them, so they get the hell off
the net. 

Maybe they're scared of block lists. After all, they're similar to kill
files which we all know are lists of people who need killing and since
murder is illegal and immoral kill files must be too.

Paul, maybe you don't mind somebody pouring grass killer on your lawn if
they were submitted your address over the phone and made an "honest"
mistake and fell victim to a prank, but I mind if they do it to mine,
particularly since all they have to do is perform cursory checks to
realize it's suspect. Oops, I made an example using a different subject
matter. We're in the "blatant propoganda" stage now, I suppose. 

Now, since you're all for niceness in the world, you can go jump on Tim
since he's doing this too.

  From: Tim May <tcmay@got.net>
  To: Well now I am a Mommy! <xenedra@hotmail.com>, cypherpunks@toad.com
  Subject: Re: sixdegrees

  At 6:27 PM -0700 9/13/98, Well now I am a Mommy! wrote:
  >hi,
  >
  >I see you added me as a friend..... just wondering who you are.  :)
  >
  >Christy
  >

  Hi Christy,

  Got your name from the Stalker's R Us group. Please post more details
  about your personal fantasies. Send us nude pictures, too. 

  You say you're a Mommy. Hope there are no stretch marks.

  Oh, and your children can join our group too. Got any photos?

  --Tim May

And:

  From: Tim May <tcmay@got.net>
  Subject: Re: News for class

  At 5:58 AM -0700 8/30/98, sboyd wrote:
  >Please inform me how I can get the news each day by e-mail at
  >flashboyd@aol.com.  This information will be used in my comm class.


  Hey, "flashboyd@aol.com," why are you asking _us_?

  According to AOL, "AOL _is_ the Internet."

  (Personally, I'm cheered by the news that a net.stalker is tracking down
  clueless AOLers and Webbers and eviscerating them.)

  --Tim May

SignalMonger