From: Brad Dolan <bdolan@use.usit.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 95 22:13:29 PDT
To: Mac Norton <mnorton@cavern.uark.edu>
Subject: Re: Part IX: Allegations re Vince Foster, the NSA, and Bank Spying (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950724232244.24512K-100000@cavern>
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950725010535.9324A-100000@use.usit.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


I found Grabbe's essay sufficiently interesting to forward, but all I
did was forward it.  If you have questions, you will do better to 
address them to: kalliste@delphi.com

bd

On Mon, 24 Jul 1995, Mac Norton wrote:

> Okay, thing is, I read all of the below, and it seems like 
> the guy's trying hard to tell you that he'd bend over 
> backward to make this case, even to the extent of associating
> with fringebinges like you, but your stuff keeps coming up
> fulla, um, thin air.  Huh?
> 
> MacN
> 
> On Mon, 24 Jul 1995, Brad Dolan wrote:
> 
> > 
> > 
> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 23:11:45 -0400 (EDT)
> > From: KALLISTE@delphi.com
> > Subject: Part IX: Allegations re Vince Foster, the NSA, and Bank Spying
> > 
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > 
> >    Allegations Regarding Vince Foster, the NSA, and
> > 	 Banking Transaction Spying, Part IX 
> > 
> > 		  by J. Orlin Grabbe
> > 
> > 
> > July 23, 1995
> > 
> > Gregory Wierzynski
> > Assistant Staff Director
> > U.S. House of Representatives
> > Committee on Banking and Financial Services
> > 2129 Rayburn Building
> > Washington, D.C. 20515
> > 202-225-7502
> > 
> > Dear Mr. Wierzynski:
> > 
> > Thank you for email letter, a copy of which is attached.
> > 
> > I am not sure why you think my quoting selections from Mr. Jim Norman 
> > necessarily implies endorsement or acceptance of them on my part.  I have, 
> > of course, quoted many, many selections from Mr. Norman, so perhaps you 
> > could be more specific with respect to the ones you are concerned about.
> > 
> > Perhaps I could be of assistance to your inquiries among the spooks, if 
> > only you could describe to me which points you have investigated, and how 
> > you have investigated them. I certainly wouldn't want to promote anything 
> > that, as you say, "flied in the face of facts."  
> > 
> > On the other hand, I am greatly concerned about the use by Alltel 
> > Information Services (formerly Systematics) of a libel attorney, 
> > Charles O. Morgan, in an attempt to intimidate journalists and destroy 
> > the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.  
> > 
> > And I am also gravely concerned about the possible leak of U.S. codes 
> > and nuclear secrets to a foreign power, which is an issue of *real* 
> > national security concern to the U.S.  (Of course you and I both know 
> > that "national security" is often used to hide the truth about sell-outs 
> > of national security from the American people, by clamping a lid on 
> > the discussion or reporting of things that are common knowledge among 
> > U.S. military and security agencies, and even common knowledge to the 
> > general public of the foreign power to which these secrets have been 
> > compromised.)   
> > 
> > Before reading my email, and your letter, I sent you a copy of "Part VIII:  
> > Allegations Regarding Vince Foster, the NSA, and Banking Transactions 
> > Spying".  There you will see from the quotes that the theft of U.S. 
> > nuclear secrets by Israel is openly discussed in Israeli newspapers, so 
> > I am sure that this is not one of the "off-the-wall" issues to which 
> > you are referring.  (With respect to that issue, I suggest that you do 
> > some investigation in Tel Aviv.)
> > 
> > With respect to money laundering I am not concerned,  for reasons I have 
> > indicated in my essay "The End of Ordinary of Money",  Parts I and II,  
> > a copy of which I previously provided the Committee.  The money-laundering 
> > laws ought to be abolished, but in the meantime I do find the selective 
> > enforcement of these laws troubling.
> > 
> > With respect to "Chuck in Kentucky", I know more than one Chuck in Kentucky,
> > so perhaps you could be more specific which Chuck you refer to.  What stories 
> > did he tell you, and how is it that they didn't pan out?
> > 
> > Since you have already spoken to both Jim and Chuck, I am taking the liberty 
> > of sending a copy of this letter (and your letter) to Jim Norman, and to one 
> > possible Chuck you may be referring to, so that perhaps they can explain to 
> > me their failing to satisfy you as to the accuracy of their information.
> > 
> > Now, Mr. Wierzynski, I would like to bring up an issue about your Committee's 
> > behavior that is troubling me.  I am sure that there is an innocent 
> > explanation that I am missing. You will recall the meeting that I had with 
> > you and Mr. Stephen Ganis, the Counsel to the Committee, at the Four Seasons 
> > in Georgetown on Monday, June 12, 1995.  Two days previously I had been 
> > playing volleyball in the Mall with Dana Rohrbacher and Jack Wheeler and some 
> > others, and I had pulled most of the muscles in my right ankle.  So I 
> > asked everyone I was meeting to come over to the hotel, and you and Mr. Ganis 
> > graciously consented.  We met in the Four Seasons lounge, where I was the 
> > only person not wearing shoes.    
> > 
> > You told me that, more than money laundering in Mena, Arkansas, you were 
> > interested as to whether there were any documents connecting Vince Foster 
> > to Systematics, or whether I knew the name of any Systematics programmers 
> > that may have worked to modify the PROMIS software to spy on banking 
> > transactions.  I told you I couldn't recall seeing any such documents, and 
> > that I had come across the name of one programmer, but I had subsequently 
> > forgotten it.  It was a pleasant meeting, so to be helpful I gave you a 
> > copy of Jim Norman's *Fostergate* that had been spiked from *Forbes*.  
> > "Why would Steve Forbes kill the article?" you asked.  I said I didn't 
> > know, but that--since you appeared to know Steve Forbes--you should call 
> > him yourself.
> > 
> > Now, much to my surprise, I find that the following happened:  Just as 
> > *Media Bypass* was about to run Jim Norman's article *Fostergate*, they 
> > received a letter from Charles O. Morgan, indicating grave consequences 
> > if they were so foolish as to print the article. Mr. Morgan claimed to know 
> > what was in the article, because, he said, he had received a copy from Mr. 
> > Stephen Ganis of your Committee!  
> > 
> > I am bothered by the fact that while you alleged to me you were investigating 
> > Systematics that at the same time you are passing along information to 
> > Systematics.  I am sure there is an innocent explanation.  But consider this:  
> > what if I had given you Foster-related documents and the names of Systematics 
> > programmers?  Would these have been passed along to Mr. Morgan also?  As you 
> > know, a number of people connected to this whole business have died violent 
> > deaths in Arkansas.  (Of course, I understand some of them had already been 
> > paid off to keep their mouths shut, and didn't, and so--under any standard of 
> > morality--deserved what they got.)  
> > 
> > Well, things are never what they appear, so perhaps you can clear things up 
> > for me. Please pass along my concern to Mr. Ganis, and tell him I will be 
> > glad to sit down with him and have a drink, or share a line, and have a frank 
> > discussion about this issue. (I have nothing against the use of any drug, if 
> > used in moderation, and in the appropriate context.) 
> >    
> > Regards,
> > Orlin
> > 
> > Attachment:  Your letter to me
> > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > From:   IN%"gregorw@netcom.com" 23-JUL-1995 19:53:52.82
> > To:     IN%"KALLISTE@delphi.com"
> > CC:     
> > Subj:   RE:  Part VII
> > 
> > Return-path: <gregorw@netcom.com>
> > Received: from netcom13.netcom.com by delphi.com (PMDF V4.3-9 #10880)
> >  id <01HT7ZLMQQTC9VUSVZ@delphi.com>; Sun, 23 Jul 1995 19:53:50 -0400 (EDT)
> > Received: by netcom13.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id QAA03469; Sun,
> >  23 Jul 1995 16:51:04 -0700
> > Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 16:51:04 -0700
> > From: gregorw@netcom.com (Gregory Wierzynski)
> > Subject: Re:  Part VII
> > To: KALLISTE@delphi.com
> > Message-id: <199507232351.QAA03469@netcom13.netcom.com>
> > Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
> > 
> > Orlin --
> > 
> > We're reading your stuff with interest. Thank you for including me in your 
> > list of recipients; I pass the material on to my boss and my colleagues on 
> > the Committee.
> > 
> > I am somewhat surprised, however, that you accept the Norman piece without 
> > raising any questions about its sources. We've talked to Jim and tried to 
> > check out the sources he thought he could share with us. We have also done 
> > a fair amount of investigating on our own using the resources available to 
> > us--by which I mean officials inquiries to the spooks. So far we draw a 
> > complete blank. Worse, the preponderance of the evidence suggests that 
> > Jim's piece is pretty much off-the-wall. Worse still, it appears to fly in 
> > the face not just of facts, but simple logic as well. 
> > 
> > I haven't, by any means, given up on this subject, but pursuing a trail 
> > grown cold is difficult to justify when you're paid by the taxpayer.
> > 
> > Do you have suggestions on how we could verify some of the elements in the 
> > Norman story? I've talked to Chuck in Kentucky and am still in touch with 
> > him. But his stories have not panned out, even partially. I would be most 
> > interested in your ideas. 
> > 
> > Best regards. 
> > Greg
> > 
> > - -
> > 
> > 
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>