From: Vipul Ved Prakash <vipul@pobox.com>
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 08:08:54 +0800
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Subject: Re: TCM goes to city council
In-Reply-To: <199708121951.MAA00280@netcom12.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <199708140312.DAA00972@fountainhead.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text



Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:

> seriously, if cypherpunks think government is so crappy, let see
> them invent a better alternative than that which exists. note that
> "anarchy" evades the problem completely. it's like saying, "I hate
> my web browser" and someone saying, "oh, just get rid of it, the
> alternative is far better".  an 8 year old would understand this
> logic, but alas it eludes the cpunks after many moons on this list.

i love they way your category of smartass nihilists (the _elite_ dispondent 
blockheads - btw these are proposed categories for my reputation system) 
talk about "anarchy" being analogous to someones mid-life browser crisis and at
the same time completely missing the point. ok, lemme explain what 
crypto-anarchy is and _what_ is the alternative system that some folks
"invented", while you were smoking up. 

this incedently reminds me of a conversation i had with this guy at college once, 
who insisted that i called him "razor" and was some sort of a self-proclaimed 
authority on freudian theories of conscioussness. he talks too much but is 
always willing to learn and wanted to know what the fuck is this "crypto" biz.
anyway I started it with a small introduction to the loose term "human nature" 
since he is familiar with that stuff and I think its a good place to start a discussion 
that has to with any sort of "human" system. 

The term "human nature" means that we guys have "volitional consciousness" 
which is synonymous to the concept of "self awareness" that is higlighted as 
the turning point of human existence in many eastern mystical texts. Which 
implies "choice" is the inescapable concequence of our nature and we 
need to make choices in order to exist. Those who choose poorly 
suffer or die. Theoretically this means that we need a "value system" 
to live (contrary to the popular belief ethics has hardly anything to do 
with "co"-existing) with the our standard of value as Life. 

In the social context, the "right to choose" is the basic human right.
And this was what mystics, collectivists, religious cults, popes 
and the governments decided to snatch at the point of a gun. 

And thats exactly the idea behind a virtual, cyberspacial society, 
physical coercion is invalid in this dimension. crypto provides 
the essential annonymity required to close/stonewall the system so that no 
one can trace your online avatar to your physical self. 

crypto-anarchy is thus a social setup where a virtual community of 
objects use crypto for annonymity, interaction and arbitration. one can 
think of crypto playing the government of the society. it arbitrates
by making fraud impossible. 

thats the basic idea. i suggest you look up the web, there are tons
of crypto resources. even though i am new to list i feel you certainly need 
to get yourself a straight education. i could have given you a wider introduction 
to the subject but i am tired. there are days when you keep bumping 
into these wierdo's you want to hit on the head and say "the universe
doesn't work that way". and these guys are tiring. 

best,
vipul


-- 

Vipul Ved Prakash                 | - Electronic Security & Crypto 
vipul@pobox.com 	          | - Web Objetcts 
91 11 2233328                     | - PERL Development 
198 Madhuban IP Extension         | - Linux & Open Systems 
Delhi, INDIA 110 092              | - Networked Virtual Spaces