From: "William H. Geiger III" <whgiii@invweb.net>
Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:05:29 +0800
To: Jim Burnes <jim.burnes@ssds.com>
Subject: Re: Report on UN conference on Internet and racism
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.95.971118181728.23634B-100000@westsec.denver.ssds.com>
Message-ID: <199711190153.UAA13393@users.invweb.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain



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In <Pine.LNX.3.95.971118181728.23634B-100000@westsec.denver.ssds.com>, on
11/18/97 
   at 06:28 PM, Jim Burnes <jim.burnes@ssds.com> said:

>On Tue, 18 Nov 1997, William H. Geiger III wrote:

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>> 
>> Hi Dekan,
>> 
>> I think that there is plenty of case law of extending constutional
>> protections to non-citizens. One that comes to mind were the rulings
>> against California inwhich the courts ruled the they were obligated to
>> provide schooling and social services to illegal aliens (a really fucked
>> rulling IMNSHO but if some good can come out of it no sense not making use
>> of it).
>> 

>Interesting.  I was under the opinion that schooling and "social
>services" were no more constitutional rights then, say, free food or a
>pot to piss in.

>Constitutional rights are contractual government guarantees to protect
>well known natural rights.  (pleez send all natural rights flames
>straight to /dev/null since we all know what they are and have different
>name for them) 

>Because of the kind of animals that we are, natural law has evolved as an
>emergent philosophical model that protects the right of the individual to
>do as they please and to profit from the fruits of their labors so long
>as they harm no one else.  I pretty much massacred that definition, but
>hey, I'm not getting payed for this.

>How can we provide *services* to non-citizens and call that a right?

>Who the hell pays for it?

>Of course you could make the argument that involutarily providing
>services even for citizens is brain damaged, but we call that socialism
>and take it up to argue on some other channel than cypherpunks.

Oh I agree with you here that there is not constutional right to social
services. I wish I had a reference to the court decisions on this. It was
a year or two ago regarding one of the balot propositions in California
that would cut off various social services to illegal aliens. I am going
off memory here but I don't think it ever got all the way to the SC. If
anyone has a reference to this case please post. 

- -- 
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William H. Geiger III  http://users.invweb.net/~whgiii
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

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