From: Ian Sparkes <isparkes@q9f47.dmst02.telekom.de>
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:11:52 +0800
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Subject: Re: cypherpunks and guns
In-Reply-To: <Wei Dai's message of Tue, 6 Jan 1998 00:51:36 -0800>
Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19980106144257.006f0fec@q9f47.dmst02.telekom.de>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain



-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

At 05:28 06.01.98 -0500, Ryan Lackey wrote:
><daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU> (Wei Dai) writes:
>
>> I don't understand why there is so much talk about guns here 
lately.
>> Unless someone comes up with a weapon that has some very unusual 
economic
>> properties, individuals cannot hope to compete with governments in 
the
>> domain of deadly force. If we have to resort to physical violence, 
we've
>> already lost!
>> 
>> Think about it: if we can defend ourselves with guns, why would we 
need
>> crypto?
>
>I am fairly certain that as an irregular army soldier I could 
inflict
>a substantial amount of damage upon an occupying military.  With 
maybe
>$20k in equipment and several hundred hours of training, you could 
make
>life very difficult for any luckless squad that happens your way.  
Multiply
>that by 100 million armed citizens and you see that armed civilian
>resistance *can* defeat an occupying army.
>

I'm not sure I am convinced by this argument.

The "enemy within" seems to be the main focus of the discussions in 
the CP list. When the 'luckless squad that happens your way' is 
manned by your countrymen at the command of their (and your) 
government, what then?

As far as I can see, the result would be a *very* bloody civil war. 
The outcome may indeed be less obvious than in a 'conventional' (i.e. 
unarmed populace) civil war, but the cost much higher.

This is from the standpoint of a 'sissy' European. I admit I am 
poorly equipped to comment on the American Zeitgeist. However, my 
experience of civil war victims (refugees from the E-bloc) suggests 
that we should be concentrating on social revolution before we tool 
up for military. There is more to be won, with a potentially much 
lower cost.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.0
Charset: noconv

iQA/AwUBNLImc4n3W0ooQnZKEQL4VwCffzMNK1MfQ/1zMv+E/3dfoioc8e8AoL0d
uZMzgq6LPu9nVe90kcA49cbG
=yL/D
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----