From: Jason Asbahr <Asbahr@UH.EDU>
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 93 12:20:45 PDT
To: hiscdcj@lux.latrobe.edu.au (Dwayne)
Subject: Re: distributed autonomous networks
In-Reply-To: <9310081716.AA13288@lux.latrobe.edu.au>
Message-ID: <199310081918.AA06860@Menudo.UH.EDU>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


Greets...

>    well, after reading through the backlog of spread spectrum stuff, I was
> surprised to read about the radio-network-on-a-board (Julieboard) article
> that someone posted. A couple of us here in Australia have been kicking
> around the idea of a cheap network, running via repeaters in _very_
> small boxes tossed all around a city, which would be indestructible through
> sheer numbers (a la the arpanet).
>    So: anyone got any ideas, schematics, information?

Haha!  That's exactly how I got hyped about the Julieboard --
rummaging in the backlog of the voluminous-but-valuable cpunk posts...

My question:  Exactly how cheap can we make these things?  Mass
produced boards, a bag of appropriate components, and a few dozen
cpunks working in parallel could work wonders.  

What about surface mount components?  Harder to assemble, and fewer
people have the skills, but the resulting box would be very small
and more easily concealed.

> The main idea is a huge number of small, low-power and CHEAP nodes which
> would handle through traffic which anyone with a radio modem could tap into,
> with the nodes disguised and placed in extremely hard to get to places (tops
> of telephone poles, buildings, on bridges and overpasses, etc).


> Possible power sources: batteries (but they need to be changed)
>                         solar power (Australia leads the world in solar power
>                                      technology, and I know people who know
>                                      people).
>                          Near Field Interaction and EMF pickups (stick 'em
>                             near high-frequency power transmission lines).
>                          Something that convert heat to electrical energy

If you are hiding boxes on telco poles, an obvious source of power
presents itself.  :-)

I like the EMF idea!  Ideologically and technically interesting...
Is it practical?   Heat to electricity?  hmm...

> I have no idea how this could be done across interstate or international 
> distances, but I'm sure people might have ideas. Bounce signals off
> satellites (are those big shiny things from the 50's still about?); send
> stuff encrypted via the internet, etc etc.

Someone suggested general use of IR laser links, but someone else 
mentioned that it would be a bitch to operate a decentralized network 
of IR links.  Well, lasers and microwave are probably best suited for
mid-range connections betweens clusters of boxes.

(Ham radio tinkers with microwave and laser communication experience
 should probably comment here...  )

Since the FCC frowns on encrypted amateur radio, I doubt we could
openly use the ham nets or satellites...but how about bit fiddling
with slow-scan TV?  :-)  The list has generated many good ideas
on tunneling naughty data in otherwise innocent exchanges...

How many people are interested in this idea?  Is it time for
a radiopunk task force?  Does one already exist?  :-)

Jason Asbahr                           116 E. Edgebrook #603
asbahr@uh.edu                          Houston, Texas  77034
asbahr@tree.egr.uh.edu (NeXTmail)      (713) 941-8294  voice
asbahr@gothamcity.jsc.nasa.gov         UH NeXT Consultant