From: Jason W Solinsky <solman@MIT.EDU>
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 94 19:33:41 PDT
To: jamesd@netcom.com (James A. Donald)
Subject: Re: Voluntary Governments?
In-Reply-To: <199408211758.KAA15344@netcom12.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <9408220232.AA08862@ua.MIT.EDU>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


> From: Hal
> > > 
> > > What does it mean to speak of a government in cyberspace?  It is the 
> > > government in physical space I fear.  Its agents carry physical guns 
> > > which shoot real bullets.
> 
> Jason W Solinsky writes
> > It depends on the government. You could set up a government to....
> 
> You could set up a "government" to make shoes.   If they do not use
> guns they are not a government.  If somebody does not make shoes
> he is not a shoemaker.  Governments are in the business of violence.


I'm not going to post again on this subject since it is a question of
semantics, BUT:

A government is something that makes laws, enforces laws and punishes
offenders. I don't see why guns would determine whether or not something
is a government. The control of information resources in cyberspace can
be very nearly [though admitedly not quite] as coercive as the control of
physical resources in real space. It all depends on the distribution of
total resources between physical and intellectual. Presently the balance
clearly in favors physical resources, but that is changing rapidly.

> 
> > Both of these examples are similar in that they are coercive. If you want
> > to conduct business with the governments citizens you have to obey all the
> > laws. But no force is involved. The will of the government is effected
> > entirely by economics. 
> 
> And if I wish to conduct business in a shopping mall, either as customer
> or shopkeeper, I have to abide by the mall rules.  This does not
> make the mall a government.

Why not? If you want to do business in Massachusetts you have to abide by
Massachusetts law. If you want to do business in Cambridge you have to
abide by the rules there. If you want to do business in the Cambridge-side
Galleria (may my spelling RIP) you have to abide by its rules. What is the
difference?

There are a number of municipalities in the United States that have no laws
punishable by prison, just fines (of course they are located within larger
governments for which this can not be said). The entire power of the
government rests in its ability to take away your property if you violate
the rules. Does it really change things if your property is taken away using
the tools of cryptography instead of the weapons of war?

JWS