From: lull@acm.org (John Lull)
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 05:18:48 +0800
To: dlv@bwalk.dm.com (Dr. Dimitri Vulis)
Subject: Re: "German service cuts Net access" (to Santa Cruz)
In-Reply-To: <HD5FiD82w165w@bwalk.dm.com>
Message-ID: <310c59a4.2517065@smtp.ix.netcom.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


On Sun, 28 Jan 1996 22:18:28 -0500 (EST), Dr. Vulis wrote:

> Very little crypto relevance in the following...

Agreed.  I'll not be posting further on this topic here.  If you'd
care to pursue this E-mail, I have no objection.


> lull@acm.org (John Lull) writes:

> > If this is really what Germany wants, then it sounds like time to
> > totally cut Germany off from the internet, simply in self
> > preservation.

> I'm sure this is what the German government and many German people really want.

If so, then they have the power to make that decision, and to
(largely) enforce it.  By doing so, however, they would (and should)
lose all the benefits of the internet as well.


> But, would you also argue that the former Soviet Union should not have been
> allowed on Internet because some of the information that would enter it via the
> internet would have been illegal there? I read that Singapore is similarly
> trying to restrict its citizens' access to the net.

I would argue that ANY country which actively tries to restrict
information providers in other countries through these "long arm of
the law" tactics, ought to be banished from the internet. 

If France wants to outlaw postings in English, I have no legitimate
right to complain -- so long as they limit it to postings from France.
If they were to begin arresting those from England, or Canada, or the
US, however, for posting in English, they would have gone too far.

Attempting to limit what comes into your country via filtering,
restrictions on your own carriers, prosecution of your own citizens or
other residents of your country for violations of your own laws, etc.
is one thing.  Trying to apply your laws to those in other countries,
however, is quite another.


> I think it would be more
> honorable to provide Germans with tools to access the information they want,
> even it violates their laws that we consider to be unjust.

Developing tools to access information is worthwhile.  But successfull
attacks on those providing information makes access tools worthless.
If the information simply isn't there, all the nice access tools in
the world can't create it.