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Arise, you have nothing to lose but your barbed wire fences!

1997-12-23 - Re: Freedom Forum report on the State of the First Amendment

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From: nobody@REPLAY.COM (Anonymous)
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Message Hash: cf85f12d4ccbacc44b81ea910dd8537efe32dd36f892c400c6c46595345f3065
Message ID: <199712231925.UAA06474@basement.replay.com>
Reply To: <ocrwwgw2bd3.fsf@ml.com>
UTC Datetime: 1997-12-23 19:39:52 UTC
Raw Date: Wed, 24 Dec 1997 03:39:52 +0800

Raw message

From: nobody@REPLAY.COM (Anonymous)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 1997 03:39:52 +0800
To: cypherpunks@toad.com
Subject: Re: Freedom Forum report on the State of the First Amendment
In-Reply-To: <ocrwwgw2bd3.fsf@ml.com>
Message-ID: <199712231925.UAA06474@basement.replay.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain




At 12:55 PM 12/23/97 -0500, Colin Rafferty wrote:
>William H Geiger writes:

[snip by me]

>> Really amazing how many so-called "freedom fighters" become STATIST if the
>> proper buttons are pushed.
>
>What are you talking about?
>
>Freedom of expression is not the same as freedom of oppression.

Oppression, in terms of private entities and citizens, is in the eye
of the beholder.  What you call oppression could just as easily be
interpreted as my right to free expression.  If I choose not to
associate with someone, for whatever reason, that's my right.  It's
just as much your right to not associate in any way with someone
who would treat you as such, and to deal only with people who will
not treat you that way.  That's how a free market and free society
works.

It's oppression if I not only refuse to hire you, but also interfere
with you going about getting a job somewhere else.  But until I
actively try to keep you from persuing your own rights independent of
mine, I should have the perfect right to make my own decisions on
whether or not I associate with you.

I think there's a clearer case of oppression with regards to the
government's laws dictating who *HAS* to be hired.  That's an obvious
lessening of my right to discriminate as to whom I do and do not want
to deal with.  Where else in this society is this behavior mandated?
Do I have to sit in public with a racially diverse group of people?
Do I have to make it a point to talk to at least one Asian person
every day?  What's the difference?

>If you want to live in a hut in Montana and shelter yourself from the
>real world, feel free.  Otherwise, it may be a good idea to check out
>social theories from the last hundred years.

That's ridiculous.  No one is sheltering themselves from the real world
here.  We're just questioning the dogma of these "real world experts."
Do you really think it's prudent to believe everything someone offers
up because they have an academic or "official" title behind their name?
Or a large portion of government to stand behind them?  I put more
faith in my own perception than anyone else's.

>
>-- 
>Colin
>
>

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